Tag Archives: Dresden Files RPG

Last time pays for all.

Rechan says:

On the topic of using Evocation for maneuvers: Does the target get a defensive roll, or are you just trying to statically beat their defensive skill?

Fred got this one on the comment thread. Thanks, Fred! Just to elaborate how that meshes with the earlier comment about the power levels needed for Evocation, the target still makes a defensive roll, but the attacker needs that minimum amount of power to make the Maneuver take place. So, if you’re trying to tag someone with Blown Away, and they’ve got Great +4 Might, you need to have 4 shifts of power in your air Evocation for it to affect them, but you still need to roll to hit their Fair +2 Athletics, and they get a roll to dodge it.

So any word on your next Dresdenverse campaign?

Well, I’ve talked it up with some of my players, and the interest is there. But I really want to wait until I’ve got the physical books – it just makes everything easier. That said, in the next week or so, I’m going to start posting some thoughts here about designing the campaign. Starting with some ruminations on the Power Levels and what they imply in terms of characters, stories, mood, and tone in the game. And then, I think, I’ll look at some options for settings that aren’t cities.

You can drop inhuman x or other supernatural powers into the Were-form right? Or is there anything else that symbolizes the “You have a form that you use to battle”? I’m actually pondering a “Dr Jeckyl/Mr Hyde” character.

You can certainly drop those things on the template. In fact, you must add at least -2 worth of other powers. There is, however, a limited list of what qualifies for Were-Form powers. Of course, as has been discussed repeatedly, the templates are simply a guide.

Christopher says:

Regarding what you said about Buffy-verse vampires:

That’d work. Of course, it wouldn’t be that difficult to build Buffyverse vampires with the system, but then you either need to create a new Court, or get rid of the Dresdenverse idea of Courts, with all their wonderful rich politicking potential.

Maybe vampires are like humans — and some of them just plain HATE politics. The Buffy-verse vampires, what with their long history of “impulse control,” could well be just a breed who “hate all that donkeys and elephants crap,” and are looked down on (IE “never mentioned”) by the vampires of the various courts. After all, there are renegade wizards and wild fey– why not some “rogue vampires?”

Just a thought.

Sure! That’s completely doable. It’s just that – in my mind – that’s creating a new Court, even if it’s the Court of No-Court, if you take my meaning. But yeah, that works fine.

Bosh says:

Question: how supernatural something is seems to scale with how powerful they are (more supernatural = lower refresh blah blah), how then does the game handle critters that are very supernatural but not very powerful at all such as Toot Toot?

Fred got this one, too. Thanks again, Fred! One thing that I’d add is that not all your bad guys – or good guys – need to have started at the same Refresh as your PCs. So, even if Toot-Toot has only a -4 Refresh Cost, that doesn’t necessarily mean he has free will – he may have started with a Refresh of 3, say.

Sephilum says:

What stunts must a ghoul take according to the template? And what is the base refresh cost for each?

Fred got this one, too! Go, Fred! And thanks once more! For an example of how we twisted that idea around during our playtest, check out Christian Manger. Take note, though, that the number noted for those Powers are not the same in the final game version.

P.S.

‘Thanks for doing all of this. You’re awesome!

You’re welcome!

Fred Hicks says:

Rick/Others:

I’m looking at the discussion of a pure mortal being able to fight a wizard, above — talking about an expert martial artist with a few stunts and a ton of fate points going up against a wizard, and “see how long that wizard lasts”… Well, right! Wizards are potent when they get a chance to prepare — or, if they have a solid talent at Evocation, when they get a chance to see you coming. But they’re squishy, too, which is very true to the source material. In Storm Front, Harry gets taken down by a relatively common thug with a baseball bat at one point.

How someone will fare in a conflict in our system is highly, highly dependent on how much control they have over what battles they get into and what circumstances and preparation they can bring to bear. It’s definitely a “planner’s” system in that respect — which again, we feel resembles the source material pretty well. Combo that with our advice to GMs to put the PCs under time pressure, always driving things forward, the ability to make those choices will certainly be constrained at times. That’s the tension of the novels, and that’s the tension I want to see in a game.

This is a very important little clarification here. Looking back at the discussion Fred mentions, it’s easy to see how the impression can be that Wizards don’t have a chance against Pure Mortals, and that’s just wrong. The point that I was trying to make was that Pure Mortals can share the stage with Wizards, and Knights of the Cross, and Faeries, and Vampires, and not be the weak sisters!

Character creation in DFRPG is essentially point-buy, and that means that most characters will wind up with a specialty area or two. Can Murphy beat up Harry hand-to-hand? Sure. But Harry can probably prevail at range, thanks to his magic. If you want to triumph in this game’s conflict system, you gotta know your Sun-Tzu, and bring your strength against the enemies weakness.

And surprise, as ever, is the great equalizer.

Rel Fexive says:

Hey.

Numero uno – Evocation can be used for an attack OR a manoeuvre – um, maneuver – but it takes a bit more power to do both? So a ‘firebolt’ could burn someone or set them “on fire”, but more power will do both at the same time?

John Hawkins came up with a good compromise for this on the comment thread. Thanks, John! One thing that needs to be said, though, is that you essentially get a Maneuver whenever your target takes a Consequence – the attack is putting an Aspect on the character. So, if you hit someone for 5 shifts of damage with your firebolt, and they’ve only got 4 stress boxes, they may wind up taking the Consequence Clothes on Fire from the attack.

Numero, uh, duo? – I like the ‘rogue’ or ‘wild’ vampire idea for a Dresden/Buffy mashup, but if I were bringing the two together somehow I think I would concentrate more on bringing a Slayer-like character into a Dresden game then trying to force the two to mostly coexist somehow. To me there are too many disparities (the Courts, the nature of vampires, etc) for it to be a smooth blend. Others might have other ideas of course

Both universes are pretty full of good source material and rich mythology. Picking and choosing what you take from each is the secret to a good mash-up, and everyone’s gonna have their own ideas.

Only one more Q&A?!? How will we cope?!

Re-read the novels. That’s what I’m doing. 🙂

James says:

When can I buy it and how much will it cost?

John Hawkins got the when part. As for cost, Your Story is set at $49.99, and Our World at $39.99. Prices were apparently just added to the home page today.

Knave says:

My earlier point was more that the beauty of the thing is that clever aspects and a stack of fate chips to use them gives a character as much flexibility/spotlight as serious power does so packing in the stunts is certainly not the only way to skin this particular cat.

Exactly!

Tim “Your Personal Undead” Popelier says:

I don’t think this has come up yet, but I might be wrong. (gosh you should be sick of people saying that by now, no wonder your stopping)

I’m not stopping because I’m sick of the questions, just because doing this is eating all my time, and I need a little bit of that back. 😉

Anyhow, could you give us a idea of how true names as handled in the game. And perhaps also, how are they used as a bartering offer like harry does, do they add a special tag for the demon, (know part of your true name) or something like that?

True Names work in a few ways. For one thing, they act as symbolic links to a creature, letting spellcasters target them with Thaumaturgy at a distance. Second, they can be tagged for bonuses using spells (like Bindings) against creatures. Third, they can allow Evocations to target a demon’s essential self, instead of just its corporeal manifestation.

Knave says:

@Rick re: Harry v Victor S.

Thanks for the info : ) – I’m guessing that Victor’s statblock has had a tune up since it was published in the October Status update on the dresdenfilesrpg.com where it had both his conviction and discipline as Great and Killing Flame as 7 shifts ( conviction + rod + lawbreaker bonus ). – I assumed he’d cast it with a roll of 0 for an effective Weapon:7 + 4 targeting. (assuming he managed to soak up the 4 shifts of mental stress that would cause him – granted)

which would mean Harry with an athletics of Fair (again by the character sheet from the site) would need to roll better than +2 to make the dodge and avoid taking a hit of at least 7 shifts of fire damage… which basically brought me back to the magical defence, and my clarification question:

How much damage does the defence prevent? Assume that Harry does have 7 shifts of damage and 4 shifts of targeting coming at him, in order to take no damage does he need to summon up a defence of power 11 with no targeting element, only control? Or is it power + targeting of 11? i.e. in an attack the discipline ‘finesse’ element (sort of) counts twice – once for control of the power and once for targeting and in that targeting capacity as a bonus to your effectiveness – the ‘what makes Luccio so dangerous element’ – but from what you said that targeting element isn’t present in defence. Is that right?

Because if it is right Harry sure as heck better win initiatiative and shoot first, or just creating the shield he’ll be taking (superb conviction(5) 1 shift + an additional 6 shifts of mental stress to get the power to 11 plus 11 – (good discipline(3) + roll) mental stress to control it -> which works out at 15 +- 4 to defend against 11 damage… which can’t be right?

If the targeting roll does count toward the total he’d need to make a shield of power 8 (4 stress) + take 5 stress on the control (assuming he rolled 0) to control the shield… in which case he needs to soak 9 mental stress to prevent 11 physical damage… which still seems wrong.

The last possibility I can think of is that he only needs to defend against the power of the spell -> i.e. 7 damage. In which case he’d need to spend 3 stress getting the power to put up the shield and 4 to control it (again assuming a 0 roll) for a total of 7 mental stress to avoid 11 physical stress, which is at least better than dodging with an athletics of fair.

I’m probably way off base though.

Thanks again, and sorry for getting all mathematical on you :p

No worries about the math. But I missed something that Matthew pointed out below. Thanks, Matthew! You may be new to FATE, but you’re dead on with what you said.

Harry’s block only needs to beat the targeting roll. If it keeps the fire from hitting him, he takes no damage. He’d only need to soak up all the damage with the block if he had failed his defense roll entirely, in which case he’d deduct the shifts of power in the block from the damage. For an example in the novels, check out what happens when he tries to soak up a blast from a flamethrower in Blood Rites.

Lucart says:

If someone has an aspect on them like ‘Thrown to the Ground’ on them, does that aspect have to be tagged in order to impair their movement? Are they still free to move at will (with the aspect still there) as long as nobody has tagged it trying to stop them?

Knave got this one. Thanks, Knave!

Rechan says:

If DFRPG is about an enemy’s prep, how do you avoid the pitfall of “The PCs kick in the door of the villain’s hideout, and pretty much walk into a death trap because the villain has prepped his lair/has all his toys right on hand”? It’s rather easy to imagine any villain being fairly prepped for a frontal assault. And as the DM, you can give your villain as much prep as you want – so how do you justify LESS prep on his behalf?

Knave and Tim had some good advice on this in the comment thread. Thanks, Knave and Tim! My own advice is trying to stay within the bounds of verisimilitude with the villain’s prep, based on the following questions that I ask myself:

1. What does the villain want? This says a lot about his outlook. Someone who wants world domination is going to be a much better planner (well, maybe) than someone who just wants to eat all the homeless people he can find.
2. How is the villain pursuing this goal? Careful plotters are better at prep than psychotics with poor impulse control.
3. How far along is the plan? Early on, not as much preparation time has been invested than later on.
4. What does the villain know about the heroes? Pretty much every supernatural creature knows Harry, and will have some idea of how to deal with him, but fewer know Sigrun Gard, and may not have planned for that battleaxe.
5. What resources does the villain have? If you’re living on the street or hiding your dark magic from your wife, it limits what you can set up. Also, as far as resources, information sources and resources for advance warning become important.

Now, you don’t have to answer these questions in order to find out how much prep the villain can set up – you can, but you don’t have to. What I often do is work backward – decide how ready the villain is (i.e. how hard do I want to smack the players), and then come up with the answers that lead to that.

Also check out the scenario-building advice in the book. It’s got some very good bits on villain motivation and resources.

Matthew says:

(new to Fate/DFRPG discussions; be gentle)

Regarding the Victor vs Harry discussion:

Doesn’t the attack have to ‘hit’ (control roll >= defense roll) in order to do any damage at all? So wouldn’t it make sense to use your defensive magic to ‘deflect’ the incoming attack (via a Block) instead of trying to ’soak’ the damage? In the example given (Weapon: 7 with 4 control) a block strength of 5 would be enough, rather than 11 shifts to negate the damage. This might entail simply using Discipline as a Block (possibly powered by Fate points) rather than formally casting a spell. Or perhaps an actual spell would add shifts to the defensive control roll, making it easier to block attacks at the cost of stress to cast the defensive evocation.

Then again, I won’t pretend to fully understand the system. Perhaps one of the experts can clarify?

As I mentioned above, Matthew, you got this one right. I had missed this important bit when writing about it previously. Thanks for chiming in and setting us straight!

Exploding_brain says:

Could Bob be made into a playable character? Maybe only when he’s riding Mister (who obviously has an ample supply of free will to loan him). I have this image of B-squad adventure, in which Bob (with Mister’s help), Toot-Toot, and Mouse, (and maybe Billy?, or would it be more fun to add Butters or Molly?) have to deal with something in Harry’s absence.

Bob has no stats in the book. Could he be a playable character? Sure, you could work him out that way, especially with him riding Mister to cut down on the cost of his Spirit Form power. And that B-squad adventure sounds like fun, though I’d go with Butters rather than Billy or Molly, just to keep the overt powers down. But that’s just me.

What kind of game mechanics reflect Little Chicago?

No game mechanics are given for Little Chicago. I’m gonna quote the reference from the book here, because I think it’s a beautiful example of how flexible the game is, and how much room there is for both player and GM creativity:

Little Chicago gets some play here, but it’s unclear how that manifests—is it a complex high quality spell component, or an actual focus item investment, or a special plot contrivance concession by the GM? Jury’s out— each GM out there might run it differently.

See what I mean?

How hard would it be to remove the problems that wizards have with post-WWII technology? Maybe you want to drift the game into something that would allow Mage style Sons of Ether, or Ghostbusters tech. Or possibly you want that one-of-a-kind wizard who has found a way to prevent that particular complication.

Bosh is right that it’s easy to remove. Thanks, Bosh! But there is a little more to the effect than just compelling an Aspect. There are rules and mechanics for both accidental and deliberate hexing of technology, for good and ill.

Do other types of magic mess up modern tech? Could Harry use Toot-toot to wipe the hard drives of his enemies?

Hexing is reserved for mortal spellcasters, and there’s a very interesting discussion as to why that is in the book.

One last time, thanks so much for the (deep and extended) peek at the game. It makes me more confident that ever to say the following:

@Evil Hat, now I know how some folks feel about the iPad. To misquote Ryan Sohmer, I dearly want to transfer money from my bank account into yours, and I’m OK with that.

I’m right there with you, my friend. And thanks for the kind words.

Murph (No,not that one) says:

Just found out about the upcoming DFRPG a few weeks ago and have greatly enjoyed reading this Q&A, so a big CHEERS to Rick and all the contributors.

On behalf of myself and all the other folks chipping in, you’re welcome!

Anyways, a quick question if you don’t mind. How much refresh does Physical Immunity cost during character creation? (I have a descendant of Balder concept for an NPC I would mind solidifying up a little)

Physical Immunity is a stunning -8, but you get some of that back when you take a Catch, which is required for the power, as John Hawkins points out in the comment thread. Thanks, John!

Thanks for all your effort Rick, it must have been quite taxing at times.

You’re welcome. It was work, but it was a labour of love.

@Fred It’s been close to 13 years since I’ve done the whole P&P gaming thing,but this has seriously relit the fire so to speak and I can’t wait to get my hands on the books. The fate system sounds awesome and much more along the lines of how I prefer to play than the old systems I did indeed play. I think I will have to buy SOTC to get a general feel for the system while waiting for DFRPG. (not to mention it sounds pretty damn cool itself!)

John’s recommendations for other games to check out is very good. I would go a step further, and say to take a good look at the Indie Press Revolution site – there’s a wonderful, varied assortment of games that will knock your socks off. I’m particularly partial to Dogs in the Vineyard, Trail of Cthulhu, and How We Came To Live Here for innovative design and cool ideas.

So, thanks for the hard work and the openness about the development of the game. I, and I’m sure many,many others, really appreciate it.

Seconded!

Oh, also, from a previous Q&A session someone was asking which element lightning came under air or earth. I don’t have it with me, but I seem to remember in Storm Front (novel or comic) that Harry was talking about all five elements being present within the storm while squaring off against the toad demon. I swear he states that lightning represented fire, just in case anyone was still wondering. I’m probably wrong, stupidity runs in the family.

There’s a good discussion in the Evocation section called Mommy, Where Does Lightning Come From? that talks about how phenomena can be mapped to different elements, based on the desires and imagination of the Wizard, so yeah, lighting as Fire works just fine.

Knave says:

@Matthew – re: magic defence

That’s possible, but my understanding is that a fire evocation produces actual fire, so it doesn’t really track to be able to deflect it just by rolling discipline without casting – unless you can do the same thing against a flame thrower.

True, but if the block makes the fire splash into the wall instead of hitting you in the face, you don’t need to worry about the fire. Well, not as much. As for the flamethrower, the difference is that magical fire will require fuel to keep burning. If it hits a barrier of force in mid-air, there’s nothing there for it to burn, so it goes away. A flamethrower, though, is spewing burning fuel that sticks and clings to the nothing in the air, and we go again to the scene in Blood Rites.

Rel Fexive says:

RE: magic defence — such a defence, like with Harry’s shield bracelet, is apparently done as a Block that can be eroded by every attack it blocks (or so I’ve deduced from previous comments). I’ve not got ‘the book’ but I reckon that means that a character would cast a spell in the normal way (power/Conviction, then control/Discipline) to end up with a number of shifts that represents the strength of the Block/shield. This would probably then be matched against the number of shifts used in the attack – any attack – and probably with the “damage bonus” added on; so shifts + Weapon:X vs Block shifts, because heavier hits are harder to stop.

I imagine the Block then either stops the attack cold (by having more shifts) or lets some through (by not having enough), and can be reduced by the hit in some fashion. This would seem to reflect the source.

/guesswork

Evocation blocks collapse if the attack punches through. They also only last for a single round, unless you spend some of your power shifts on maintaining it. But if you use it as a defense instead of armour – the deflect vs. soak discussion from above – you only need to beat the targeting roll to avoid taking damage.

vultur says:

Are there stats for fungus demons?

In general, asking for a complete list would probably be too much; but we’ve seen previews of the character types, but not really anything on the monsters. Can you give an idea of what monsters are included?

Rechan gave a very nice and complete answer to this in the comment thread. Thanks, Rechan!

Lanodantheon says:

Awesome Q&A!!!

Thanks!

Probably the last question I’ll be able to ask before just doing it myself when the game comes out.

How would I give someone a “Spirit Sword ” ala Yu Yu Hakusho. Basically it’s a conjured sword made of Spirit energy. My first blush is Claws.

If anyone else with access to the material cares to weigh in, please do.

And indeed, someone else did! Thanks, John Hawkins! His very complete response pretty much covers anything I could have thought of, and more. There are a myriad of ways of doing something like this in the system; you’ll pick the one that produces the jazz you like best when you build your character, and negotiate with the GM.

It’s all about negotiating with the GM. 😉

So, we wind down to the end of this little Q&A.We’ve got 14 installments, and a total word count just north of 37,000. That’s about a third of a good-sized novel. And this final one is the longest of the bunch.

I’ve put a link to the complete Q&A series on the DFRPG Playtest Samples page, so it’s easy for folks to find.

I want to thank everyone who has come by to read, to ask questions, to answer questions, and just generally talk about the game. I think you all start to understand my enthusiasm for the game by now, right?

And you’re all going to buy it, right?

I especially want to thank Fred, Lenny, and Chad, not only for joining in on the discussion and helping keep me honest and on track – obviously, they know the game far better than I do – but for having the visionary idea of a Disclosure Pledge for the playtesters in the first place. It’s a fairly new way of looking at the community of gamers, as a vocal force that you can mobilize on behalf of your product, and it shows a great deal of respect and appreciation for their fans out here in the world.

And it let me see and talk about the game early, so bonus! 😉

It’s been a fun ride, everyone. Thanks for sharing it with me.

Now I go back to my other games, and my other writing. But I’m not leaving Dresden Files behind. Not by a long shot.

I am eagerly awaiting the June release of the final hardcover books, so I can get into setting up my own campaign.

Fin.

Unlucky 13! Black 13! Jacques de Molay, thou art avenged! Other obscure 13 references!

And away we go…

Bosh says:

The more I hear about the magic system the more I want this game, it’s the first time that I’ve EVER heard of a magic system in a game that functions like how magic generally does in fantasy novels. If the system actually works as it’s described that’ll be a massive step forward for the Fate system. I’m already having ideas floating around my head about how to hack it for other settings. For example in a more historical game it seems you could get an awesome magic system by just ripping most of evocation out.

I’m tremendously happy with the feel and mechanics of the magic system. And you’re right – the system is eminently lootable for other games where you want the same sort of feel from the magic system.

Atlatl Jones says:

You wrote about the spray attack as a “special action”. Are there other kinds of special actions detailed in the book?

First off, “special action” is my term, not a game term. It’s a special-case rule governing one narrow type of situation. There are a couple of other things, like special effect attacks (tasers and the like, for example), impact damage, explosions, environmental hazards, etc. The place they fit in the game is more as a side effect or special circumstance to a normal situation that requires a few extra rules to give it the proper feel.

I’m also curious how the extended conflicts rules work, the ones that were based on Spirit of the Century’s chase rules.

They work pretty much the same as in SotC, but are slightly simplified to cover more options without getting bogged down.

Bosh, I agree. If I felt like running a Buffy game, I would use this in a second (maybe with one or two extra boxes of stress). Buffy clearly has a low refresh, and Willow spent so much refresh on magic powers that she briefly became an NPC.

It would work very nicely for this.

Right now, though, I want to run a Victorian London version of the Dresdenverse. Maybe centered upon the upheval that Bram Stoker unwittingly unleashed upon the vampire courts’ balance of power.

Ooooooh… that sounds like a lot of fun! If you do run something like that, please let me know how it goes.

After taking another look at the power list, I’m convinced that the Dresden Files RPG would be a great fit for the Fading Suns setting. I’d just borrow the starship combat rules from Diaspora, and make all the motley aliens, theurgists, psychics, Changed, and symbiotes using the powers. There’s not much like evocation, but theurgy is basically thaumaturgy, and I could see some theurgists or psychics having channelling for a single element or type of force.

As I said, the magic system is eminently lootable for other settings. Fading Suns is a setting that I really like, though I always felt kind of let down by the system.

Bosh says:

Atatl: exactly, just like SotC unleashed a whole flood of people hacking SotC to different genres, I think we’ll see the same kind of flood with Dresden magic and creature creation rules (which are pretty generic/toolkit-ish) being adapted to all kinds of fantasy. For example the rules we’ve seen so far for statting out supernatural creatures seem like they’d be absolutely perfect for, say, Simarillion elves (too low refresh and you get on a boat ) that can actually work in a party without either watering them down to humans with pointy ears or having them steal all the spotlight. Low refresh works beautifully for the sort of powerful but passive shtick we often see with Tolkein’s elves. And this is just one example, I could think of a dozen more just off the top of my head.

I love this take on Tolkien’s elves.

Ryan says:

I have been stalking your Q&A and I must say, WOW! Great info.

Thanks! Glad you’ve been enjoying it.

I have been loving Dresden Files for a couple years now and this game is driving me nuts with anticipation. I actually do have a question. I don’t think it has been asked yet….

I think it was Gard that was described as using runic magic, like the electrical serpent in the security locker. Would that function as a magic item (soda grenade?) or more like a spell with a conditional trigger? Sorry if this has already been touched on. There has been an incredible amount of awesome here.

Nope, it hasn’t been touched on. In the book, Sigrun Gard is statted up as having Sponsored Magic: Runes. The actual building of the electrical serpent thing would probably work best as a Thaumaturgical ritual, setting a conditional trigger as you suggest.

As for other cool worlds you could use this system on, I’m thinking Elric would be a great fit for the thaumaturgy rules, maybe even Evocation.

Definitely for the Thaumaturgy, though I don’t recall anything in the books about wizards blasting away with power. Still, it could work, if you do it right.

Rel Fexive says:

The good work continues. Um… that’s legally different from The Good Work that we leave to holy types. Anyway…

😉 Probably for the best.

Hi! Can you give us a real brief (like, X is +1 and Y is +3) comparison between weapons (melee and guns) as presented in the rules? I just want to see how they stack up compared to those +8 Earth Stomp spells… I gather much of their advantage is situational, though, so I understand if their ’stats’ aren’t defined enough for such a comparison. The situational stuff itself sounds pretty nifty, too, but I won’t ask you to go into detail on that

Sure! Here’s the default breakdown:

• Weapon:1 – small pocket weapons, knives, saps, and “belly guns”
• Weapon:2 – Swords, baseball bats, batons, most pistols.
• Weapon:3 – Two-handed weapons, oversized pistols (Desert Eagle and company), rifles and shotguns, most fully automatic weapons.
• Weapon:4 – Anti-personnel weaponry, explosives.

As you note, though, this can play a bit fast and loose, depending on the situation. The advice is pretty light on this – basically, adjust up or down depending on how nasty the weapon is under the circumstances.

Ta!

You’re welcome!

Exploding_brain says:

Regarding advancement, it sounds like the “deepest” suggested starting level is Submerged (10 Refresh, 35 Skill points, and Skills capped at Superb).

Correct.

How much deeper does it look like the system lets you go, and how quickly do you acquire those Minor, Significant and Major Milestones?

There is no inherent limitation on advancement. A lot of it is going to depend on what sorts of stories you’re trying to tell. If you want the tale of big-league heroes fighting off the Outsiders and defending all of reality, that’s certainly doable as you increase in power. The real limitation is going to be the GM’s ability to generate interesting, challenging foes and circumstances as he players acquire more and more resources. And that doesn’t look too difficult, what with the build-it-yourself functionality of the Supernatural Powers and the way you can shift conflicts around in three different arenas. I’d say the system supports you right up to at least a Refresh of 20 or 30, after which the GM will have to start considering how to stat out some of the “plot device” foes.

As for how quickly you acquire the advancements, again that’s going to depend on the GM and the stories you’re trying to tell. The default recommendation – and they clearly state that it’s just a recommendation – is:

• Minor Milestone – conclusion of a  session, or when a significant story piece is resolved.
• Significant Milestone – conclusion of a scenario when a major plotline is resolved, or about every two or three sessions.
• Major Milestone – only when something happens that really shakes up the campaign, after a few scenarios or a long, large-scale plotline is resolved.

Do they have guidelines for, say, Harry at the beginning of Small Favor? Any indication for how deep you can go before the system begins to break down? (insert clever submarine, nitrogen poisoning, crush depth, silly extension of analogy here).

They’ve actually got a full page discussing how Harry “levels up” at the end of each novel. By the end of Small Favor, they set him at -16 Refresh, starting from -9.

As for when the system breaks down, it looks pretty scalable and robust, as I mentioned above. I’d be leery of reaching beyond about Refresh 30, myself, but that’s just because I find it more interesting to have stories centered around people with more mortal concerns than you’d really have left at that level of power.

Calvin says:

Hi Rick. Thanks for all your Q&A. All your hard work is much appreciated.

Thanks! I’m glad you’re enjoying it.

Can you tell me about Martial Arts? Are there Martial Arts stunts and Skills? Can you let me know what kinds of stunts are in the book? Do they split things into Hard/Soft styles or types (ie Karate, Kung Fu, etc). And can you combine martial arts with Evocation (ie to create Chi fireballs a la Dragonball).

Lanodantheon got the core of this. Thanks, Lanodantheon! All martial arts would be handled by the skills Fists and Weapons (depending on the style), and then you’d use added Stunts to round them out. As the Stunts are basically do-it-yourself, you can decide the mix of hard/soft, internal/external you want. There are a few example Stunts, like Martial Artist, but this is an area where you get to brew up pretty much exactly the kind of martial artist you like.

And yeah, if you’ve got the Refresh to spend, I can’t see any problem with combining Evocation and martial arts. No problems, at all.

I am asking because I am going to run a Dresden game in Hong Kong and martial arts will be important. Thank you very much.

Sounds very cool. Let me know how it runs for you.

Popo says:

Thanks for these Rick. I’m definitely getting this book.

You’re welcome. And getting the books is, I believe, the proper way to thank Evil Hat for allowing this to happen.

“And can you combine martial arts with Evocation (ie to create Chi fireballs a la Dragonball). ”

Could Channeling accomplish this? I imagine that if you could have a fire channeler, you should be able to have a spirit or force channeler too.

Yup. That would work quite nicely.

I can’t wait to get this for a Buffy campaign I’m going to run. I might just merge the two worlds/stories… I can see many ways that a slayer might exist in the Dresdenverse and I prefer the Dresden File’s magic system. *fan squeal*

Chocolate, meet Peanut Butter.

Atlatl Jones says:

While I don’t expect the game to have detailed martial arts rules, I’m curious about how it represents Murphy’s Aikido.

Well, she’s got Good Fists, three stunts to represent different facets of her martial arts training, three different Aspects that could easily get pulled into a martial arts action, and a raft of Fate Points to use those Aspects.

Popo, I like the way you think. Buffy and the Dresdenverse fit together perfectly. The buffyverse was always rather vague about the nature of magic and the supernatural, so adding in the detail from the Dresden Files would help a GM out a lot. Buffyverse vampires and Black Court vampires have almost identical strengths and vulnerabilities, aside from Buffy vampires being much prettier, so you could just say that all Black Court vampires have the Human Guise power.

That’d work. Of course, it wouldn’t be that difficult to build Buffyverse vampires with the system, but then you either need to create a new Court, or get rid of the Dresdenverse idea of Courts, with all their wonderful rich politicking potential.

Having both the White Council and the Watchers in the same setting opens up a lot of interesting dramatic possibilities too.

It certainly could. Indeed, the Watcher Council could sort of fill in (or share) the niche currently occupied by the Venatori Umborum.

Exploding_brain says:

Can you give us a brief description of how defenses are addressed in the mechanics? For instance, Harry’s leather duster and shield bracelet?

They are produced by two different sub-systems of magic. The duster is an enchanted item that grants Harry armour, so that’s shifts of stress coming directly off attacks. The shield bracelet is a focus item that gives him a bonus to control with defensive Spirit evocations, which manifest using the block mechanic, which is kind of like less enduring armour.

If you wanted a character with bulletproof skin, would it be similar to Harry’d duster, or a supernatural stunt? Could a wizard/sorcerer/channeler/magic mortal take those kinds of supernatural stunts, or are some things like inhuman toughness limited to vampires/faeries/lycanthropes etc?

Inhuman (and higher levels) Toughness are the way to go in order to simulate bulletproof skin. Mythic Toughness gives you Armour:3, so that offsets the damage bonus of things like hunting rifles and Desert Eagles. Coupled with the extra stress boxes it gives you, it very nicely simulates someone who is just damned tough to hurt.

Inhuman Toughness is generally available, but the higher levels require having specific templates in order to take them. At least, by the book. That’s easy for the GM to handwave, but the high levels of all the stat boosting powers are awesome, and letting too many creatures have them would tend to water down their cool factor. Having said that, if I were running a game, and someone started with a lower level, I would be amenable if they wanted to upgrade later using the advancement system.

Knave says:

re: aikido

@Atlatl

just try running a mock combat with a 12 refresh pure mortal with fists 5 and athletics 4 say and a few ‘murphylike’ aspects e.g. ‘aikido champion’, ‘cute as a button, but hard as stone’, and maybe even ‘Having another bad day’ (just for good measure) and try putting her up against a wizard… see how long the wizard lasts : p.

Well, she’s not rated quite that high by the book – Good Fists and Athletics. But then, she’s statted out as of Storm Front. As Rechan points out, she’s got a nice stunt that let’s her tag an opponent with the Aspect Thrown to the Ground with a successful defense roll using Fists, as well as a couple of other handy things. The applicable Aspects she has are Don’t Judge Me by my Size, Aikido Master, and Avenging Angel. And her Refresh Cost is -4, so she’s got a stack of Fate Points. It’ll come down to that old contest of whether she can lay hands on the Wizard before he can blast her with Evocation.

Very few things can stand up to a couple of rounds of +6 bonuses so a 12 refresh character is pretty much guaranteed a few rounds of shining brilliance. I wouldn’t be surprised to see one lay the smackdown on a black courter – for a few rounds anyway… :p

My view of combat is that, contrary to something like D&D, where hitting for damage is of primary importance, using maneuvers to impose Aspects is paramount. If you set up a few of those, and pass the free tags to one character who can unload with a few Fate Points, things go splat in a very satisfying manner.

Knave says:

I have a Q about using magic- specifically evocatiion to add aspects to targets. If you want to do something like set a target’s clothes on fire or glue them to the floor how do you go about setting the spell’s power?

Good question! You do this by using Evocation to perform a Maneuver, imposing an Aspect on a successful targeting roll. Power required for a Maneuver defaults to three shifts, but if the target has a resisting Skill of Great +4 or better, then that’s how much power you’ll need. So, if you’re using an Air Evocation to put the Aspect Blown to the Ground against someone with a Might or Athletics of Superb +5, you’ll need five shifts of power. You can also channel extra power to make the Aspect persistent.

Also, how do magical defences/counters work? If, for e.g. Victor Sells hits Harry with his Killing Flame Rote for +7 damage with another +4 on the targeting, how does Harry go about defending himself from a potential 11 points of owie? Does he have to create a fire shield of power 11?

He has to create some sort of shield with a power of 11 if he wants to avoid getting crispy. Now, that said, hitting someone with 11 shifts of stress is gonna be moderately rare – Victor’s rote only lets him call up 5 shifts of power, so he’d have to beat Harry’s dodge by +6 to get that 11 shifts of damage. Considering Harry’s got Athletics equal to Victor’s Discipline, Harry would have to roll at least a -2, while Victor would need a perfect +4 roll. So, yeah, the example you cite looks pretty rough on the defender, but you need to understand the context of those numbers, and see that such a situation would be a real exception to the norm.

Thanks again for all the info!

You’re welcome!

Looks like that’s it for this penultimate edition of the DRPG Q&A. If you have any more questions, make sure you get them to me by Friday, ’cause that’s the last installment, and I will be deaf thereafter to your pleas! Mwahahahahaha!

Ahem. Sorry. See you Friday.

I’m back. It was a nice break.

We’re getting near the end of useful things I can say about the books without cutting and pasting huge swaths of them into my post, so this week, I’m only going to update the Q&A on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, and then probably say we’re done. Really, a lot of the questions are starting to deal with minutiae, whether of system or of content, and that says to me that most of the big questions have been answered.

Yes, I know that it will still leave some of you unsatisfied. But you knew this ride was going to end some time, right?

That said, it’s not like I’m going to stop talking about the game. I’m getting pretty excited about starting up a campaign, myself, and have started doing some thinking along those lines. I’m going to be doing some posts about the thinking and planning process of getting the game up and running, though this is very early days, yet. The game probably won’t start until after I manage to buy myself a hard copy of the book, which means June at the earliest. Yeah, I could start running right away with the playtest version, but having a physical copy of the game just makes things so much easier. Besides, this way, I’ve got a nice lead time to plan.

Anyway, that’s the plan for the future of DFRPG on this blog. And so, without further ado, let’s get to the questions!

Zooroos says:

Hi! I’ve got an easy one, maybe it was already answered. Do Mortal stunts cost Refresh?

Bosh and Lanodantheon got this one on the comment thread. Thanks, Bosh and Lanodantheon! Yeah, they do, and it’s one point each. Some also require Fate Points to use.

A most excellent Q&A thread Rick, thank you and all the people who heeded the call for nice, sweet spoilers!

You are most welcome. And I’m glad your enjoying it.

Lanodantheon says:

Here’s a question Rechan might be able to answer over Rick’s much needed weekend, how does the RPG define the law, “Thou shalt not reach beyond the borders of life.”? Does it cover just Necromancy (magic involving the dead) or does it also include magic to lengthen your own life span such as giving yourself inhuman recovery(a healing factor)?

Rechan fielded this one. Thanks, Rechan! I do want to add one point: giving yourself a permanent healing factor through Thaumaturgy would be prohibitively complex, simply because of the need to expand the duration. Now, the easy way to do it is to take Inhuman Recovery, pay the Refresh cost, and say, “I did this with my magic!”

Exploding_brain says:

Regarding fate points, free tags, and backlash. In SotC, it’s always been my understanding that you make your roll, check out the result (even the NPC’s result, if it’s contested) and then decide if you want to use fate points or any available free tags to add bonuses or re-roll. Based on the description of Harry trying to manage a +8 discipline roll, it sounds like that may not be the case in DFRPG. Can we get a quick synopsis of how that may have changed?

I hasn’t. The reason I did it that way was that, even with his blasting rod to help him control the power, Harry would have needed to roll +4 on four dice, which is an 80:1 long shot, so I did it a little bit out of order.

Thanks.

You’re welcome!

Rechan says:

On the topic of spray attacks (Thanks Fred for fixing the Earth Stomp issue), I thought it was a decreasing effect. You know, if you attack two guys, your first attack is at a -1, but your second is at a -2. Reading Fred’s analysis, you can split them up in any fashion you want (So if you have a +6 on your roll, it could be a +4 to attack 1, +2 to attack 2, or +3 to both attacks, or any combination thereof). Which is nicer.

The decreasing effect kicks in if you’re making separate attacks – then you take a -1 for each additional supplementary action. But this is one special action: spray attack.

Also, yes – catching a wizard off guard is going to be bad news for the wizard. But then, catching ANYONE off guard is generally bad news in a system where you can easily get greased.

Which is why I’m starting to think the Concession rules are such a good idea.

Iorwerth says:

I was wondering if it is possible to have a list of the mortal stunts – it would be very interesting to see if any of them are the same as in SOTC!

I’m gonna say no on this one, for two reasons. First off, there are over a hundred in the Stunts chapter, and that’s too much to just list here. Second, they are only examples: the emphasis of the chapter is on how to build your own, tailor-made stunts for your characters. There are some stunts that you will recognize from SotC, but some of them have been tweaked to work better with the source material.

Iorwerth says:

I meant mundane stunts, I think!?!

You were right the first time. Mortal Stunts.

Knave says:

Thanks for the reply, but just to clarify.

Does a wizard take ( 1+ Spell Power – Conviction ) stress _as well as_ whatever he or she missed the discipline+focus item roll by (with the option of throwing this out into the environment) for rotes? And does the spell also fail if it isn’t a rote?

Rechan jumped on this one. Thanks, Rechan!

Thanks for your great work!

Thanks for the kind words!

Rechan says:

Rick: Where are the gun stats listed at?

Page 202 of Your Story.

Minor Inconvenience says:

Rick: Thanks for taking the time to answer my (and everyone elses’) questions. I’ve waited for 4 years for this game and this last bit of waiting is almost the worst of it.

You’re welcome. I’m waiting anxiously for the final, hard-copy version, myself.

Knave says:

@Rechan,

Rechan got these. Thanks, Rechan! I’m adding a few clarifying notes where necessary below.

I’m basically trying to clarify the casting process and what the total stress spend on an evocation is. My understanding is

1) decide how much power you want to spend. That establishes a basic stress cost for the spell of ‘Chosen Power’ – Conviction +1. Assume 8 power – 5 conviction +1 = 4 stress.

That’s correct.

2) roll Discipline to control that power – so roll disc v 8. If you miss that number you can take the difference as more stress, or blow it outward. However this is also a targeting roll. Does blowing the missed control stress outward rather than taking it on yourself have any effect on the power of the spell? i.e. If you miss the power by 3 and blow the power outward rather than take it as stress – does that spell decrease in power as a result?

It does indeed. Plus, you now have some interesting environmental effects to deal with.

3)From what you’ve said if it’s a Rote then you don’t have to roll even to target the spell, so if you know a power 8 rote, you can always make that attack without rolling at all? Is that right?

No. You do need to make a targeting roll with a Rote spell. While the spell always works, you might miss with it.

4) Assuming you make it, and your opponent doesn’t dodge they take Power:8 + Disc roll – Defense Roll. So, at least 8 stress, and you take at least 4 stress.

That’s correct. Given that most starting characters will have four or five stress boxes maximum, that’s a devastating hit for both of you. But more for him.

5) Is there any possibility of failing to cast a non-rote spell?

Failing? Kind of. If you fail to control the power you’ve channeled, and can’t afford to take the stress hit as backlash, then you’ve got a whole bunch of fallout around you. That’s a nice, spectacular failure. For Thaumaturgy, if you just can’t get your Lore to match the spell Complexity, you fail to cast the spell.

Yikes – maybe I had more questions than I realized. I really just need to get my grubby mitts on the book I guess : )

June is coming, my friend!

Thanks for the info!

On behalf of Rechan and myself, you’re welcome.

vultur says:

That pain-blocking thing Lash teaches Harry. Is that in the game, and if so is it a Mortal Stunt or a Supernatural Power? It’s not all that clear, but it *seems* to be non-magical, more like one of those body-control things martial arts masters can supposedly do…

I couldn’t see that written up anywhere. It would be easy enough to model in the system in a number of different ways, either as a Mortal Stunt or a Supernatural power.

Also, if a Pure Mortal takes up a Denarian coin (presumably by accident), then gets rid of it, do they get their +2 refresh bonus back when they go back to being nonmagical? And does a Changeling that makes the Choice to be mortal get the bonus?

These aren’t explicitly covered in the rules, but I’m with Fred and Knave on this one. Yes, they would get the bonus. But really, it depends on the kind of game you’re running and the kinds of stories you’re trying to tell.

Iorwerth says:

Any chance of a rundown of the stunt building rules?

As Fred said on the comment thread, these aren’t easily extractable. You’re looking at 10 pages in the book, crammed full of illuminating examples. The high level view is that you pick a skill, decide what extra bit the stunt adds to it, and negotiate with your GM about whether what you’ve done is acceptable. Some of them will cost you a Fate Point to use if they’re very good.

But I can’t wait – I might explode through excitment!

😉 Dump some of the levels of excitement as fallout, rather than taking it all as backlash. That should keep you alive until June.

Lanodantheon says:

I seem to be good at answering my own questions, so I may just end up answering this myself in this comment and Rick or the designers or Rechan can just nod and go, “Yeah that’s about right…”.

What element(s) do explosive reactions fall under? Say the evocation spell in question turns otherwise benign materials into a short-lived magical explosive. (This is primarily for a Warlock bad guy BTW)

I could see it falling under Fire or Earth. Air can make naked kinetic energy but that’s just the shockwave. The purpose of the spell is to destroy an object entirely and turn the whole thing into shrapnel.

Fire: This would already be used to make something combustible, but an explosive could be be made by increasing the material’s potential energy and releasing it.

Earth: An explosion is when the matter of a solid object converts itself into a gas rapidly. You rearrange the particles in the matter or break them apart. This would probably only work on materials that come from Earth such as soil, rock, concrete and metals and the more unrefined metal the better. If you try this on plastic or fabrics you’d be SOL.

I think I did just answer my own question and if so, enjoy the info Q&A goers.

Yeah, you pretty much answered it. Rechan also provided some extra examples on the comment thread. Thanks, Rechan!

One seemingly prevalent misconception is that there are hard and fast lists of what you can do with each of the five different elements. That’s not the case. There are examples, and some discussion of the areas where each one is strong, and what the feel of the different elements is like.

But there’s also a sidebar on using different elemental models, like the Chinese one, or possibly the Medicine Wheel idea of North American native peoples. And another sidebar on whether lightning is the province of Air or Earth. Here’s the telling line from that sidebar:

Figuring out how to creatively apply your command of the elements is one of the most fun parts of being a spellcaster…

So, how do you figure out if a character can make an explosion with his or her command of an element? Ask the player how they plan to do it. If they can give you something even borderline plausible, say yes. Using Water to force entropy on the bonds holding the molecules together? Cool! Bang! Using Spirit to supercharge the tiny spiritforms of the various components of an object so that they react violently to the presence of each other? Cool! Bang! If it sounds good and adds to the fun, then it works.

At least, that’s the kind of thinking I find the game encourages.

vultur says:

So, the whole Senior Council is statted? How do his stats deal with Eb’s ludicrously powerful stuff mentioned in Blood Rites: Tunguska Event, Krakatoa, etc.?

Rechan and Knave got this one. Thanks, Rechan and Knave! I just want to add one note specifically about the staff – in the Notes section of Ebenezer’s stat block, they make it pretty clear, without coming out and just saying so, that the staff is pretty much a plot device machine. It does what the story needs it to do.

Rechan says:

Hey Rick – what Supernatural powers need/use Fate points to work? I haven’t spotted any.

None that I’m aware of. You pay your Fate Points up front by spending Refresh for Supernatural Powers. Otherwise, Wizards wouldn’t be able to actually do anything with all their funky powers.

Sandy says:

So… what’s this game all about, Rick? ;>

Cute. Just remember, funny lady, I know where you live.

That’s it for today. Next installment of the Q&A is on Wednesday, but only if I get questions.

You know what to do, folks.

This one goes up to eleven!

Folks, this is likely going to be the last Q&A for this week. There definitely won’t be one tomorrow, and I may not get back to it before Monday. I’m going out of town for the weekend and, truth to be told, I need a bit of a hiatus from this. It’s fun, but it’s taxing.

So, keep the questions coming if you have them, but please understand that I won’t be answering them for a couple of days.

With that out of the way, let’s get rolling!

Mike Ryan says:

I can`t believe you`re still at it. Nicely done.

Thanks! Glad you’re enjoying it.

In an earlier post you mentioned the different tiers of play (submerged, feet in the water, etc). I`d like to get a feel for what those power levels feel like. Harry (in Storm Front) is supposed to be the poster-boy for Submerged, so that one is pretty straight forward, but I`m not very clear on the others. Can you list a couple of characters for each tier? I’m obviously just looking for names here, not asking for a stat block or anything.

Fred pulled together the best answer for this on the comment thread. It is kind of hard to estimate, in part because the stat blocks in the book only list spent Refresh. For those of you who missed it, Fred’s list was as follows:

Feet In The Water – Father Forthill

Up To Your Waist – Alphas (maybe)

Chest-Deep – Molly (maybe)

Submerged – Harry

He added some caveats, about how this was pretty rough, and many of these folks could be bumped up or down the ladder a little bit.

Thanks again.

You’re welcome, again.

John Hawkins says:

Note that the following is really just a lot of rambling from my head, so take it for what you will.

You bet. I like rambling.

The way they’re setting up power levels, they aren’t really defining capability, but rather how much capability you can have and retain free will. Now, free will (in FATE) is it’s own kind of direct mechanical power, but if I describe two characters to you, one with the ability to lift small trucks and summon fire from thin air, the other with no extraordinary capabilities whatsoever, they could both be refresh 8, but the first would have (roughly) 2 refresh remaining of her free will, while the second would have the full complement of 8 + 2. A character with -9 worth of powers has slipped too far into that power to be a player character (at chest-deep).

One of the interesting things that using Refresh to represent free will does is that it gives people with more Refresh more opportunities to transcend their own limitations. I look at it as what you choose to define yourself: if you have all these amazing abilities that you’ve worked to acquire, you have more of your sense of identity bound up in those things, and you have a more natural tendency to accept the implied limitations. If you haven’t spent all that effort to learn magic, for example, you don’t hold yourself as limited. Harry knows that he can’t take on a troll hand-to-hand, but Murphy doesn’t know that – she just knows that she has to, and therefor she does.

Or something like that.

I was thinking about these issues more today, and it brought several things into greater clarity. The idea of lawbreaking and the significance of Greater Powers in the game, in particular.

Lawbreaking is a negative refresh power, and confers bonuses. Bonuses for doing POWERFUL things! Like killing foes outright, or walking backwards through time. But exercising that power quickly sets you on a path that you cannot control unless you possess tremendous amounts of innate willpower (base refresh). And notably the “power” of lawbreaking kind of sucks, insofar as its application promises to take you on an accelerating path to servitude, even if it’s not clear _to what purpose_ you would serve.

The book brings up an interesting point about this. Basically, the Lawbreaker powers say the you ARE the type of person who would, for example, kill someone using magic. You’ve proved that, because you used magic to kills someone. You can fight against it, but you’ve already made a choice that marks you.

Now, we might presume that the Queen of Summer possesses tremendous amounts of innate willpower. But she also must join battle with the forces of Winter, even when the costs are, well, everything. So when it comes right down to it, she actually has very little practical free will. The idea of being an NPC and the idea of being beyond your own control are intriguing ideas to bind together.

As a GM, it also helps you to build consistent behaviours and choices for your NPCs. Just follow the Aspects, assuming that they’re being compelled with every choice.

Obviously this all gets fuzzy and frayed at the edges, but compared to the usual deal where there is absolutely no justification at all for the line between PC and NPC (or hero and prop), and players are power limited by fiat alone, it’s a pretty neat concept.

I agree.

It also makes it a bit clearer why Rick (and of course the authors) advocates so heavily for the +2 pure mortal bonus. That first touch of power has *tremendous* cost. And it should.

I guess my takeaway is that part of what makes power supernatural is that it pulls you away from this stable, rational world in which we control our actions*.

Yes. Very much so. You have given voice to an idea that has been brewing in my brain.

So you can be powerful, or you can have a firm tether to reality, and each is its own kind of strength. Indeed, the choice a Changeling must make is perhaps the most profound choice the game offers relative to its own metaphysics. A Minor Talent or a newly minted Changeling is in fact somewhat weak, because they have not yet committed to conventional reality or turned their back on it. But they are also very powerful because they have the best of both worlds — they have not yet lost their core being to their power, and yet they have power through which to channel the lions share that remains.

A very nice discussion of the issue. Thanks, John.

keegan says:

thanks for answering my questions

You’re welcome.

is there a money system or rules for how favours work

Bosh got this one on the comment thread. Thanks, Bosh! You’re dead-on right, though there are some extra mechanics for favours that you owe the sponsor of your sponsored magic.

Bosh says:

John Hawkins, I also think the big hit for taking your first bite of the supernatural makes a lot of sense because:

-It provides a nice dynamic tempting players to dig in deeper (well I’ve already blown my mortal bonus, might as well get something out of it when I advance my character…)

Indeed it does.

-I’m assuming that generally the marginal utility of more supernatural powers starts dropping after a while. What I mean by that is that going from no magic to fire Evocation is a BIG increase in your power but each additional element you add on on top of that gets less and less helpful (because you can only do one thing every round). This keeps people from being able to do one kind of supernatural thing really really well and then doing it over and over and over again with only a minor refresh cost. If you want some powerful supernatural shtick, you’ve got to pay for it. FATE really shines at kicking min-maxers in the nuts (I can’t think of any games with SotC’s level of complexity or greater that are anywhere near as muchkin-proof) and this seems to be something in that tradition.

I find this an interesting statement, because I think that FATE games can be min-maxed with all the others. The difference is that the real pay-off is in the Aspects. Picking the right Aspects can really help out the rest of your mechanics. I always tell my players to pick Aspects that can do triple-duty: you can invoke them for a bonus with your skills and power, you can be compelled to earn Fate Points, and you can invoke them for effects. Players who figure out this little trick get some amazing synergy out of their characters.

However, and this is where the genius lies, this means that, to get the best out of such Aspects, you have to roleplay them. You have to use them as tools to help you play your character in order to get the most mechanical benefit out of them.

Basically, what I’m saying is that the system isn’t hard to min-max, it’s hard to min-max in a way that doesn’t serve the play experience of the whole group. It’s a subtle trap that takes munchkins and turns them into roleplayers.

Ihadris says:

A list of the skills as they stand would be fantastic but I didnt want to ask for them as I thought it might be overstepping the bounds a little. It came out of looking at the skills in SotC and thinking if skills like art, or pilot would still be as I couldnt think of much of an application for them in terms of Dresden games.

Knave has pointed out where you can find such a list. Thanks, Knave! I’m going to post a list from the book, anyway, just in case there are any differences.

• Alertness
• Athletics
• Burglary
• Contacts
• Conviction
• Craftsmanship
• Deceit
• Discipline
• Driving
• Empathy
• Endurance
• Fists
• Guns
• Intimidation
• Investigation
• Lore
• Might
• Performance
• Presence
• Rapport
• Resources
• Scholarship
• Stealth
• Survival
• Weapons

Knave says:

Ok, here’s my Q – relating to the discussion of control rolls above and the process of spellcasting.

How are these people making these rolls?

Fair enough with Thaumaturgy where you can essentially do maneuvers to give yourself a bunch of free tags by roping in eighteen chapters of freemasons, but with evocations you need to be spending fate like it’s going out of fashion to control a complexity 8 spell… and wizards are the people with virtually no fate points to begin with.

I assume that because these are rotes that the wizards concerned don’t have to worry about making the control roll – it’s just there for targetting purposes. So, e.g. Morgan tries to hit the 4 targets with his Earthshock. His discipline is 4 and he rolls a -1 making for 3 shifts of targetting. He now has to split that between the 4 and take whatever mental stress is required because the spell has a higher power than his conviction? Is that right?

First of all, 8 shifts of power is a lot to control through evocation. Morgan does it because Morgan is good. That said, it’s not completely out of the realm of possibility for a “lesser” character to pull that off every once in a while. Let’s say you’ve got Good (+3) Discipline, just like everyone’s favourite Wizard PI. He’s using his blasting rod, for a +1 to the control, and invokes his Wizard PI Aspect, for another +2. He’s now at Fantastic (+6), and may choose to chance the roll, though the odds aren’t great. To make sure he can control the power, he can either invoke another Aspect (though that will cost him a second Fate Point), or maybe he decides to take 2 stress worth of backlash, giving him a Legendary (+8) before the dice bounce. Now, he can still blow the roll, but he’s up there.

And he’s probably not going to do this more than once per session or so. Not only does channeling that much power tax him a lot (a 3-stress hit for exceeding his Conviction), but a Weapon:8 attack is on par with getting hit by two artillery shells. It will outright kill pretty much any mortal it hits.

So, yeah, the example we used is high-end, but it’s not out of the running for Wizards. You don’t want to get on the bad side of a Wizard.

as an aside: I love the way the Fate system plays out the fact that the more powerful you are the more you act in terms in of your nature. It’s both very realistic and very pretty. The less people fear the consequences the less they deviate from their nature, the more used to not deviating they become. It’s there in SotC, but the refreshes are much lower in Dresden bringing it to the surface with far more force.

I agree. It just works very nicely together.

vultur says:

Are there rules for Rituals? In the books even pure mortals can do supernatural effects this way (the adult movie entropy curse cult in Blood Rites) but I’m not sure how this would work balancewise in game, since the major limit on them in the novels is that well-known ones don’t work since the power of the entity the ritual calls on is divided up to the point of uselessness.

Or is it like Sponsored Magic? But rituals aren’t really an ability of the *character*…

Rituals that anyone can use (as opposed to the specialized Thaumaturgical Rituals that spellcasters use) are governed by the Lore skill. So, yes, there are rules in the game for it, and it’s different from Sponsored Magic. Basically, if you can find a Common Ritual (as they’re called), you can roll your Lore to try and cast it. But Common Rituals are pretty rare.

Minor Inconvenience says:

How does advancement work? I’ve seen some indication that it is done primarily through a gradual increase in refresh rate, but what about the skill pyramid (if it even is still a “pyramid” shape)? Anything you can reveal would be greatly appreciated.

Advancement works in Milestones. There are three levels of these: Minor, Significant, and Major. They happen when the characters accomplish things of the appropriate significance. Each type of Milestone has a list of what your character gets – for Minor Milestones, you pick from a list, and for Significant or Major Milestones, you get the whole list, plus everything that the lower level(s) of Milestone gives you.

One of the things you get at a Significant Milestone is an extra skill level. The skills aren’t arranged in a pyramid for this game, but in columns. So, instead of needing one more skill at the next lower level, you need an equal number of skills at the next lower level.

And the big thing for a Major Milestone is that you get a point of Refresh.

One of the cool things about the game is that there are also rules for advancing the City, so the setting changes along with your characters.

Fred Hicks says:

Behold! A decision on Earth Stomp (and evo sprays in general).

New approach:

When you’re casting a evocation spell, you’re rolling once, with your Discipline, both to control the amount of power you’re summoning up — 8 shifts in the Earth Stomp case, setting the control difficulty at Legendary (+8) — and to target the attack. When you split up the attack spray-style, you split those controlled shifts of power and you split the targeting result. Let’s say you really rock the house and make a Discipline roll of L+1 (+9). You’re controlling all 8 shifts of power (you determined & announced those ahead of time, which set your control difficulty), and you’ve got 9 shifts of targeting too. You split those 8 shifts of power up into 4 Weapon:2 effects, and you split your targeting into one Good (+3) attack on the guy who’s up in your face and three Fair (+2) attacks on his back-up dudes.

This is in CONTRAST to how the spray rules work for someone attacking with a regular weapon like an automatic gun. The Weapon:X value on a mundane weapon does not get split up, since its value is not *produced* by the attack. So if you had a Fantastic (+6) attack with a Weapon:2 gun, you could split that into two Good (+3) attacks all at Weapon:2, three Fair (+2) attacks all at Weapon:2, etc.

Thanks, Fred! I think I speak for everyone when I say we really appreciate this clarification.

Atlatl Jones says:

I really like how Lawbreaker works. It sounds likely a deliciously seductive slipperly slope. I could very easily see that mechanic being borrowed by Star Wars version of Fate.

It’s tailor-made to handle stuff exactly like the steady, tempting slide to the Dark Side.

I’m also curious about rituals, mainly because I’m in the middle of reading Blood Rites. (I want to read most of the first 10 books before I get the game, because I avoid spoilers like the plague; I was disappointed that the reveal about how White Court vampires work was spoiled for me by reading the archetype writeup).

Well, The answer to that one is up a little bit in this post. And yeah, the game does have some spoilers for the novels, but that’s really pretty much unavoidable when you’re doing a sourcebook.

Lanodantheon says:

@Rick The following is a series of comments and not questions, feel free to omit to cut down your word count for the inevitable Spinal Tap joke.

You totally called the Spinal Tap joke. I felt it was a humour imperative, considering my audience. 😉

It is not difficult to make a Wizard or should I say Wizard-like character at lower power levels. I’d use an aspect called, “Plucky Apprentice” . You just have to a remember that an apprentice has no political ground to stand on until they become an actual Wizard.

True, especially if you don’t take full Evocation and Thaumaturgy, but instead take Channeling and Ritual, or some other lower-powered set of abilities. It restricts what you can do, but you can get a Wizardy taste at lower power level games.

The +2 bonus to Pure Mortals to me is absolutely necessary in a game like this. For me it and The Laws of Magic solve the “Jedi Problem” as I call it. The Star Wars RPG is notorious for its Force User/Non-Force User system and fun balance issues.

In Star Wars, it is not fun to play second banana against someone who can pull a Star Destroyer out of orbit no matter how many blasters you have(because that Jedi is pretty immune to it).

This is the practical reason for it. If you make a game where people can play Wizards and non-Wizards, the non-Wizards have better have some fun stuff to do, or no one is gonna want to play them. And that would kind of undermine the world as developed in the novels, where Murphy can hold her own beside Harry.

In DFRPG, it is comforting to know that can Magic Users run out of gas rather quickly if they aren’t careful while Pure Mortals have it in spades, that guns are the great equalizer and that Magic can have the same level of cool as firing 2 guns whilst jumping through the air.

I agree with this about 90%. The only thing I would change is that I would say that surprise is the real equalizer in this system. Give a Wizard a few seconds to think, and he’ll whip up a ward around him if he doesn’t already have a magic leather duster. But surprise him, and you can take him out with a baseball bat to the head.

Rel Fexive says:

When asking my question in the previous edition I’d completely forgotten you’d already said “who’d a’thunk it”, Rick. How weird is that?

Spooooooooooky!

Anyway, more great questions and answers here. Thanks to Bosh and Rick for answering my query; it was the ‘Lore for Alertness’ thing I was looking for, but the info on how The Sight works is appreciated nonetheless. Thanks guys!

Speaking for Bosh and myself, you’re welcome!

I have another question, and one more vague than before: just how magical are Baltimore and Chicago as presented? One of the things I’ve noticed from reading playtest comments is how often the Dresden-ised cities seem to be seething pools of hidden magicness, with spirits, ghosts, faeries and city-wide magical effects around every corner – something that, to me, isn’t apparent from the books. A lot of the time they end up like how World Of Darkness cities seem to be, where every important thing that has, will or can happen has a supernatural origin. Are Baltimore and Chicago written up in the same way? Is this presented as the expected way to do things, or are they more toned down/less obvious than that, or is that just one of the ways a group can “magic up” their city of choice?

The Chicago chapter is called Occult Chicago for a reason. The cool thing about it is that, while it doesn’t have any game stats the way the Baltimore chapter does, it throws buckets of real-world weirdness at you, coupled with a few specific references to Dresdenverse to tie it into the game.

As for the Baltimore chapter, it’s pretty heavy on the supernatural, as well, but not at the expense of the mundane interest. I mean, anyone who’s watched The Wire can come up with some great non-supernatural monsters and heroes, and this chapter certainly helps that along. But the main focus is on the supernatural landscape.

It’s a bit different than the World of Darkness stuff, though, because the supernatural in the Dresdenified cities happens in parallel to the mundane, not superseding or controlling it. For example, while Bianca was a vampire prostitute with some high-powered clientele, she didn’t run crime – or even just prostitution – in Chicago. Harry’s now a Warden of the White Council, but he has zero pull with the mayor or even with most of the cops. The supernatural is prevalent, but separate in most cases. Marcone’s recent signature to the Unseelie Accords may be setting a very dangerous precedent.

All of that said, the cities focus on the supernatural mainly, I think, because it’s reflective of the novels. It’s pretty easy, given the city creation process, to set the dial where you want it to be, and that choice is going to be informed by the power level you set the game at. You’re going to emphasize different things for Feet in the Water than you are for Submerged.

That’s it for this installment. If you’ve got more questions, send them in, but remember that there may not be a Q&A update again until Monday.

Thanks, folks!

Ten! Ten, I say!

John Hawkins says:

Interesting — Item of Power and Sword of the Cross are listed separately, above. Am I correct in guessing that the Swords are called out more as an homage to their DF-relevance than because they are really a different power? Or are they somehow outside the scope of a standard Item of Power (like maybe the second section could have been called “Weapon of Power”, and can do somewhat different things from an IoP)?

Fred got this one on the comment thread. Thanks, Fred!

Lanodantheon says:

So, what’s used to build attacks for those items of power (like a magic sword)?

I could see Breath Weapon used to make Link’s Master Sword. I don’t know how a PC would justify having it let alone why it would exist in the Dresdenverse, but you could do it.

He also got this one. Thanks again!

Atlatl Jones says:

Does the Lawbreaker stunt have a mechanical benefit or effect, beyond moving the character closer to being an NPC?

Lanodantheon got this one. Thanks, Lanodantheon! However, I do have a couple of clarifications. First, you get a new Lawbreaker power for every new law you break. Each one only gives you the bonus for using magic to break that specific law again, and each one costs you -1 Refresh. If you have three or more of the Lawbreaker powers, the bonus increases for all Lawbreaker powers. And habitual offenses do kick in if you break the same law three or more times: the bonus increases, as does the Refresh cost. So, gaining Lawbreaker powers starts you sliding down towards NPC-hood.

Iorwerth says:

I may have missed it somewhere, but what are the mechanical differences between sponsored magic and non-sponsored magic?

Ihadris answered this one. Thanks, Ihadris! You got it right, but I’m going to supply a little more detail.

Your sponsor and his/her/its agenda can greatly affect your magic. For example, Seelie Magic is more potent for healing and more effective against Winter Court opponents than mortal magic. And it can supercharge a power you already possess on your own – this is where things like Hellfire and Soulfire come into the picture. You can also, from time to time, call on your sponsor for aid, essentially invoking an Aspect without spending a Fate Point, but that puts you in debt to the sponsor. And the debt will be collected. And, of course, as Ihadris said, if you try using the magic against the agenda of your sponsor, it’s not going to work nearly as well, if at all.

Ihadris says:

Again, as always, thanks for writing these Rick. I was just catching up on the Q+A’s and I wanted to ask another question further to one I asked previously concerning skills. In relation to vehicles you said that “Specifically, there are no rules for vehicles in the books.”. Does this mean that skills like ‘Drive’ and ‘Pilot’ have been removed?

Well, Pilot has been rolled into Driving, but Driving still exists. What I mean is that there are no tables listing different stats for cars, or planes, or tanks, or motorcycles, or boats. This is not a (mundane) gadget-heavy game – most equipment is handled through handwaving, as pieces of narrative colour and story props, not as items with their own mechanics attached. The exceptions are weapons and armour, which are each broken into four broad categories, and magical toys like focus items, enchanted items, and potions, for which there are more extensive rules.

And you’re welcome!

I understand completly where and why you have drawn the line and had assumed as much previously which is why Im not asking for you to give out a full list.

I appreciate the understanding, but lists are easy. It’s when we get to people asking for a complete description of everything you can do with the Deceit skill, for example, that I have to say no. What did you want a list of?

John Hawkins says:

I was trying to think how to model various types of cool characters, and it occurred to me that I’m not sure how the system as discussed thus far would model Inhuman+ *Precision*. I’m thinking of Kincaid, here, but in general I know how to simulate creatures with really badass endocrine, or musculoskeltal systems (speed, recovery, toughness, strength), but what if I want to model a really improved nervous system that allows for incredible precision with a firearm or something like that. Is there an obvious way to model such a thing? (I assume so, since there’s a write-up of Kincaid.) I guess you could get partway there with mortal stunts, but the same argument could be made for feats of strength or recovery, and there are outright supernatural powers for those, so I feel like there ought to be something with a bit more oomph.

Rechan’s chimed in with an answer in the comment thread. Thanks, Rechan! I have some further comments I want to add, though.

Kincaid is modeled by giving him Superb combat skills, along with Inhuman Speed and Strength, a nice array of combat Mortal Stunts and Aspects, and a possible Supernatural Sense. While it would be possible to build an Inhuman Precision power, I would be very wary, because it could easily become too good. If you plan on going that way, I would strongly recommend paying very close attention to the way Speed, Strength, and Toughness are built – different bonuses for narrow applications of things, rather than one big blanket bonus covering everything. Otherwise, I think the power would become so good that no character would pass it up, which means that their foes will probably have it, which means it’s kind of like nobody having it.

Anyway, that’s just my two cents on it.

Iorwerth says:

Thanks Ihadris. If your magic comes from a sponsor do you use evocation and Thaumaturgy mechanics, or has it got a system of its own?

You use the same mechanics, but there are a few tweaks, depending on what type of sponsor you’ve got. Basically, you get to be a little better at a couple of things.

Rechan says:

So can the game be played Solo (1 player, 1 GM)?

Definitely, though I recommend in that case that the GM create a character or two as NPCs in order to give the PC some folks to share novels with. And some contacts in the game, of course.

while a focused practitioner wouldn’t be able to make an Evocation potion specifically, Thaumaturgical rituals can be built that do the same things, only slower – or in potion form.

Now, what do you mean? How would you mimic evocation with thaumaturgy? I know that T takes longer. But are you saying that you could create the same effect for a potion/ward, even if you didn’t have it? Since I thought that T was limited merely to making declarations.

Thaumaturgy is far broader than that. You can use Thaumaturgy for pretty much any effect you can imagine. They even stat up Victor Sells’s tear-your-heart-out ritual in the rulebook. In the Thaumaturgy section of the Spellcasting chapter, there’s even an entry on the subject of Enhanced Evocation and Duration. Basically, by taking the time and building the ritual, you can use Thaumaturgy to strike an enemy with power, either in the form of a curse or as a direct attack.

I want to answer Iorwerth’s question, but I’m actually confused. I can’t figure out why Sponsored magic costs MORE than when it clearly comes with bigger limitations.

If you just go with Sponsored Magic, you actually get away with it being cheaper. Taking Seelie Magic or Unseelie Magic gives you the ability to use a narrow set of both Thaumaturgy and Evocation for -4, instead of the -6 it would normally cost you. If you buy it as an upgrade to either Thaumaturgy or Evocation, you get it at -3, and at -2 if you already have both. The bonuses depend on the type of Sponsor: Seelie Magic ignores one step of Toughness possessed by Winter Court faeries and a talent for biomancy, while Kemmlerian Necromancy gives you bonus specializations to power and complexity with necromancy. Stuff like that.

John Hawkins says:

@Rechan @Iorwerth my understanding from earlier discussions of the topic was that Sponsored magic allows you to call upon greater levels of power from your sponsor than you would be able to safely summon up by yourself, and that the constraints placed upon you by that sponsor are not sufficient to zero out that advantage. As to how that works mechanically, I’ll have to defer to those of you holding the book.

That’s the bottom line. I’ve laid out some examples above. Thanks, John!

John Hawkins says:

@Rechan — that does partly answer my question, but I’d love to see an actual synthesis of such a power as an example of how those very guidelines for new power creation are laid out. And to be clear: I’m actually more interested in Inhuman Precision or something that would allow you to very precisely aim a weapon at a long distance or that kind of thing. Heightened perception would factor into that, but it’s only part of what I was envisioning.

There aren’t actually any power creation guidelines in the books, but it’s fairly easy to eyeball things and set Refresh costs for them. The key is to keep the scope of the power in mind.

For example, Inhuman Precision strikes me as being a particularly slippery thing to nail down. Obviously, you want it to work with ranged weapons. How about lockpicking? That can benefit from the same type of combination of heightened perception and body control. And acrobatics? Driving? Martial arts? The scope begins to creep very quickly.

One option is to be very restrictive when creating it, maybe even renaming it to Inhuman Marksman and only making it apply to ranged weapons. Another possibility is to make it cost more Refresh because of its broad application; Inhuman Strength is -2, so maybe make Inhuman Precision -4, say.

Personally, I like the way they did it with Kincaid: Inhuman Speed, Superb Guns, several Stunts, and a few relevant Aspects. However, if that doesn’t do what you want it to in the game, then building a new Power may be your best bet.

Rel Fexive says:

Here’s another question for you – who’d a’thunk it?

That’s what I said! 😀

When Harry does that thing with his “wizard senses” to sense wards, spells, magical creatures (like fetches) and such, how does he do it in the RPG? Is it a spell effect, a narration of the use of his Investigation skill, an extension of his Sight power or something else?

Bosh gets part of this in the comment thread. Thanks, Bosh! The information is pretty much spot-on with The Sight stuff, though there are more rules attached to it than there were in the playtests, which produces a little more guidance as to what sorts of Assessments characters can make with The Sight.

The bit missing is something that I don’t think has been mentioned on my blog yet. Wizards can use Lore as a substitute for Alertness when inspecting magic with their normal senses. This is primarily how Harry detects magical effects and creatures, though he needs to use The Sight if he wants specifics. Although, as Bosh noted, that can be dangerous.

Thanks!

You’re welcome!

Bosh says:

I’ve love to play a burned out old wizard (so old he’s forgotten his childhood) who doesn’t have any power left (or memories of how he lost it) except Wizard Constitution and The Sight. His shtick would be that due to long experience and a horrible memory he’s mostly immune to the mental damage you get from The Sight and keeps his Third Eye open far more than just about anyone else can do without going crazy.

I like this idea a lot! Reminds me of the old Fallen Jedi template from West End’s Star Wars game, or the burnt out street mage archetype from the original Shadowrun. Cool!

Rechan says:

I seem to be at a loss how the math works here, Rick. I read the examples, scratch my head, and don’t see how they play out.

Look at the Earth Stomp spell (293). It says that it starts with 8 Shifts. Then the Discipline roll is 8 (so, 16 total). Now, it says the target rolls 2. Which results in 10 shifts? That doesn’t add up! 16-2 = 14!

So where do the numbers come in as far as spell slinging and resolving it all go?

I think the math is off, but not in the way it first appears. Here’s how I work it out. Fred or Lenny, am I doing this right?

First off, the Discipline roll of 8 is just enough to control the 8 shifts of power. You don’t add them together. Now, to target the four enemies that the spell describes, you’re making a spray attack (p 236), so you split your 8 shifts of Control (which is also the targeting roll) into four attacks of Fair (+2) with the power split between the four targets for four attacks of Weapon:2, as per the Evocation Attack section on p 251. So each target should take a stress 2 hit, plus every whatever they missed the Fair Might check by.

Is this right, guys? Do we split both the targeting and the power when using an Evocation as a spray attack?

Rechan says:

I wish there was an “edit” comment button. i have thoughts way after I posted.

Sorry, man.

Is there anything about spellcasters supercharging spells? For instance, Harry using the Lightning storm to blow up the toad demon. Or was that just a special effect for E?

That was Harry dumping Fate Points to tag a whole bunch of Aspects, including the Lightning Storm Aspect that was on the scene. And he still wound up taking a whole bunch of backlash!

That’s it for tonight. You know the drill, folks. I’ll be back tomorrow evening if you leave me more questions.